Comments on: Kline: Canadians flock to Minnesota for health care, Mall of America

By: The Canadian Health Care thread - Politics and Other Controversies - Page 18 - City-Data Forum

Mon, 26 Oct 2009 22:08:16 +0000

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By: Mill

Mill — Mon, 27 Jul 2009 15:03:41 +0000

and if a visiting medical patient is stopping at Mall of America to shop, perhaps those patients are relatively well, and not representative of the range of health care clients that show up at medical facilities, whether in the US or Canada.

By: Mill

Mill — Mon, 27 Jul 2009 14:41:28 +0000

When i meet Canadians, they express preference for their system, have no desire to spend what the US does to get what the US does in health care.

These poor fools north of the border believe public involvement in important institutions like heath care and banking is a good thing.

And THEIR BANKS DIDN”T COLLAPSE! And their population enjoys health outcomes more impressive than those of the US.

Imagine that

By: Tim

Tim — Fri, 10 Jul 2009 04:52:17 +0000

Walk into a Emergency room or doctors office and say… Chest pain -Heart or acid reflux ? Rectal Bleeding-colon cancer or piles ? Headache-brain cancer or headache ?

In the US the choice is obvious -Heart attack,colon cancer and hematoma call the specialists send your bill and pay your malpractice premium….Is that medicine ?

By: Joe SawBones

Joe SawBones — Sat, 13 Jun 2009 01:22:27 +0000

Flame baiter anti-singlepay right wing scum should be going it alone. No freeways to get to
hospital (commie government paid for them), no heli fly in when cut up by boat prop at the lake,
just row down the river with your good arm ya wimp. No county trauma center when the kid falls
out of a tree or is ground to sausage in the farm accident, fly your own doc and operating room
out of the cities at your own expense. And get to Iraq and fight your own dang war you nancy-boys.

By: Gardoglee

Gardoglee — Fri, 12 Jun 2009 18:35:07 +0000

As to FastFacts contention tahqt Montreal has only two MRIs, I would counter with the question, how many MRIs does one city need? I would say more than two for a city the size of Montreal, but far less than what we are seeing in the US. I have woirked with healthcare systems for the past 17 years. One of the controls put on the healthcare in most parts of the country is the requirement that a healthcare provider prove that there is a medical need for a new facility, like adding beds to a hospital, or an expensive piece of equipment. The idea is to try to control costs by not allowing each hopspital to try to build to supply the entire market, and then bill back the expansion costs to patients. Whether one believes that approach has worked or not, it has been applied more rigrorously in Canada, as it is in some states as compared to Minnesota. So if there are only two MRIs in Montreal, it is because some committee has decided that wo is enough to service the number of MRIs medically necessary for the people there. That, in turn, is because of the level of control allowed over the clinical care system in Canada (or more likely by the provicial government, just as states regulate this function currently in the US). In other words, we already have that sort of control in effect by law in the US, and the control is over clinical care, not over financing and payers (made up of insurers, self insured companies, Medicare and Medicaid). And with what we have now we pay more than Canadians per person, and they get better outcomes. That is the real bottom line. We pay more, they get more. Again, we pay more per preson, they get better medical care outcomes. It’s that simple. And if that isn’t the proof their system works better, then what is?

By: Tim

Tim — Fri, 12 Jun 2009 15:35:46 +0000

My niece is an American living in Canada. She loves the Canadian health system. My daughter in law is an American living in Canada. She loves the Canadian health system. My daughter is an American living in England, she loves the UK health system. Prior to moving to England, she lived in Sweden and……………well I won’t be redundant. I spent 20 years traveling in Europe on business, including 5 years meeting with private businesses that provided medical devices. I spoke to hundreds of people about their health system, and I don’t ever recall hearing anyone say they wanted the American system or they came to the U.S. for healthcare. If these countries systems were so bad, there would be extensive debate in their Parliaments, and that just isn’t happening. I hope Americans stop being gullible and cowardly and look at facts this time.

By: Colin

Colin — Fri, 12 Jun 2009 15:26:19 +0000

To the corporate stooge, FastFacts:

America is sick of your “don’t get sick” healthcare. How can you even compare American healthcare to Canadian or English medicine when we can’t even get our infant mortality rate above that of Cuba, a nation which has been the target of a medical embargo for over fifty years? Japan, which pays only about one-third of what we do on healthcare per capita, has double the daily smoking rates and gets double the number of MRIs we do in America.

According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, we’ve had 2500% growth in the number of health care administrators since 1970, people who provide no actual care, but who drive up the cost of medicine, deny sick patients, and tell doctors how to do their job in a cheap and irresponsible manner. Healthcare costs went from 9% of GDP in 1980 to 16% today, but most health quality measures have dropped. We’ve received less than nothing for our money.

For the record, more Americans are going to each of Mexico, Thailand, or India for procedures than Canadians are coming here. Of the few Canadians coming here, some work, study, or live here and others are sent directly here by the Canadian health system with money provided in order to diminish the patient backlog. They’re not paying out-of-pocket like we are forced to. If we had trained a huge number of doctors and nurses instead of administrators, neither Canada nor America would be having shortages of medical professionals.

By: FastFacts

FastFacts — Fri, 12 Jun 2009 11:38:42 +0000

This article is way off the mark, check out the truth on http://www.AmericanParchment.com. I know people who come to the United States for our health care system. They know that if they are here and get hurt they won’t have to pay, like illegal immigrants but while they are here they pay for their medical needs. The poor system in Canada can be summed up in one fact. In a city of 3 million people Montreal has only 2 MRIs. Why is that when each of our hospitals have at least 2. You are put on a waiting list there. You are not given the care needed if you are too old. And in England you do not get cancer medicine for certain cancers after the age of 65. Don’t believe me, read the articles from both Canadian and UK newspapers on this site.

By: Wayne

Wayne — Fri, 12 Jun 2009 05:02:23 +0000

Dennis called Gratzer out on his misinformation and lies:

Rep. Dennis Kucinich (D-Ohio), the left-wing former presidential candidate, described by the chairman as “among the most fierce and articulate advocates of single-payer.”

Kucinich was definitely fierce, if not entirely articulate, as he directed his rage at the bespectacled scholar.
“Do you know what . . . the median wait time is across Canada for elective surgery?” Kucinich demanded.

“Why don’t you inform us, sir?” Gratzer replied.

Kucinich gave an answer but, before Gratzer could argue with him, went on. He then quizzed the witness about “how many medical bankruptcies there are in Canada.”

“Depends on how you define med –” Kucinich cut him off. “None or very few. How many insured Americans go without needed care?”

The witness paused before looking up. “Oh, am I allowed to answer?”

“If you have an answer,” Kucinich said. “But if you don’t, I’ll answer. What’s your answer?”

“Go for it, sir,” Gratzer offered.

“What’s your answer?” Kucinich demanded.

“Why don’t you answer your question, sir,” Gratzer demurred.

“What’s your answer?” Kucinich repeated.

“My answer –” Kucinich cut him off. Gratzer leaned back, tossed his pen on the table and looked to the chairman for help. Andrews offered none.

“How many uninsured Americans go without needed care due to the high costs of health care?” the congressman asked again.

Gratzer stared at Kucinich. “The witness isn’t responding,” the congressman announced.

“The witness is delighted to speak . . . but you keep cutting me off, sir,” Gratzer pointed out.

Kucinich continued to hector (“You didn’t give an answer. . . . Can you provide us with an answer? . . . Do you have an answer? . . . He has no answer”) and the witness tried to push back (“I’m not going to be led down a garden path. . . . I dislike your comments, sir”). Finally, Kucinich demanded that Gratzer explain why 60 percent of American doctors want a single-payer system.

“Are you going to let him answer this one?” the chairman inquired.

“He can answer it, if he can answer it,” Kucinich replied.