‘You Can Run’ may be running afoul of the Constitution
Thursday, October 08, 2009 at 2:49 pm
- 12 Comments
YCRBYCH's Bradlee Dean, who plays for the group's band. Image: YouTube
Civil liberties groups say that You Can Run But You Cannot Hide International — a ministry/punk band that brings its Christian message to public school kids — is causing schools to run afoul of the constitutional principle of separation of state and church.
Rep. Michele Bachmann, who says such a separation is a “myth,” will be headlining a fundraiser for the group in November.
“We’ve made complaints about them in the past,” said Annie Laurie Gaylor, co-president of the Freedom From Religion Foundation. “And there are similar groups out there that use assembly subterfuges to gain access to a captive audience of school children.”
She said it’s incumbent on schools to research YCRBYCH before booking them for school activities.
“It is hard to believe schools don’t know what they’re getting into; all they have to do is a cursory check of the websites,” she said. “School Districts often pay exorbitant honoraria as well, so it adds economic injury to constitutional insult.”
She added that by not being honest about their evangelical mission such ministries are effectively turning public schools into evangelical recruitment centers.
“This is a devious strategy, used also by many ‘pizza evangelists.’” she said.
That term refers to evangelical ministries that seek to gain access to public school students by offering incentives not of a Christian nature, such as extreme sports, contests to win a car or pizza parties. The most common cases include these incentives along with a “secular” anti-drug assemblies, much like YCRBYCH does.
“Usually they don’t mention God or Jesus per se in the mandatory assemblies but they hand out invites to an after-hours event, often held at schools, which is open soul-winning,” said Gaylor. “It amounts to the public schools — whether officials are duped or not — recruiting for evangelists.”
While YCRBYCH admits that its public school program is designed to save souls, Gaylor says she’d doubt it’s effectiveness even if it was completely secular. “It’s dishonest and unethical, and we also question the value of the so-called secular program itself, which is often alarmist and painted in broad strokes, and can plant ideas, such as suicide, in immature minds.”
Alex Luchenitser, a senior litigator for Americans United for the Separation of Church and State, has concerns about the group’s activities — and those of similar organizations, like Power Team, a well-known evangelical ministry that uses martial arts to engage kids.
“They’d put on a secular program in the schools and then would invite kids to a separate religious event,” he said.
When asked if religion is part of YCRBYCH assemblies, the group’s front man, Bradlee Dean, was less than clear. “Morality is, which is the fruit of religion,” he said. “Our testimony of Christ is spoken of if someone asks us ‘what changed you?’”
But in public, YCRBYCH has admitted on several occasions that it’s trying to win souls in public schools. On the ministry’s radio show, one member of the ministry — talking with Dean — said they share with public school children “our own testimony of how Christ turned our lives around in public schools so we can get the light into kids hands in public schools.”
That doesn’t sit well with Luchenitser. “That this group is doing this is quite outrageous and a very clear violation of the separation of church and state,” he said. “And the fact that they seem to be intentionally misleading the schools is very disturbing to say the least.”
YCRBYCH’s “Principal Packet,” a pamphlet sent to school administrators about the ministry, doesn’t mention that it’s a ministry or that the program is religious in nature; it doesn’t mention God or Jesus Christ.
Luchenitser said that if the group is actually misleading the schools, it’s schools that could find themselves in legal trouble. “I think that because of the misrepresentations, it could subject the schools to legal liability,” he said. “Parents could turn around and sue the school.”
If the schools can prove they were mislead, they in turn could sue the ministry, he said.
Follow Andy Birkey on Twitter12 Comments
Comment posted October 8, 2009 @ 5:21 pm
Of course they are running afoul of the Constitution. But what does that matter? The Republi-thugs don’t believe in our Constitution.
If it were up to me, I’d have all of them cooling their heels in jail and reading the Constitution until they can come out and recite the segments that deal with separation of church & state. Only after they pass a test and understood the concept here would I allow them out in the general public any more.
Comment posted October 8, 2009 @ 8:17 pm
It’s hard to imagine that public schools would openly embrace a minority religious group using this same tactic to recruit new believers
and the public school audience – minors in great bulk – should not be treated as a captive market audience for exploitation by private commercial or idiological or religious purpose
Comment posted October 9, 2009 @ 11:04 am
“Christian Punk”? BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Give me a freaking break! The purpose of punk is to do what you want, how you want to do it, without the constrictions of a heirarchy telling you how to behave– the exact opposite of 99.999999% of so-called modern “Christians”.
I haven’t heard these guys, but like the vast majority of so-called “Christian Rock”, I’m fairly certain their music is derivative, unoriginal shite with a bunch of “Jeebus” shouted over the top, to make it “Christian”.
If the schools allow these guys to play, I demand they allow some good, Satan-worshiping ensembles to play, too.
Comment posted October 13, 2009 @ 9:24 am
I’ve been trying to expose these goons for years. Unfortunately they moved their base of operations away from my area and no long have the time to pursue them. A favorite was selling anti-drug t-shirts at gas stations to raise money. Once we contacted the station managers and explained what they were really about and their views, they would always be booted off the property.
I have also tried to get their tax documents since they claim to be a non-profit but have never had any luck with the IRS finding them. Anyone else ever try ?
Comment posted October 15, 2009 @ 10:37 am
I must disagree with you folks in that this not a constitutional proble. The invitation of this band is not in any way establishing a government religion (like the Anglican church in England), the wall that Jefferson referred to in his letter to the Danbury Baptists. That being said, if other religious (or atheistic) bands/groups want to perform they should be given equal time and opportunity as well. I don’t believe our children are well served by eliminating honest discourse about the differences in belief systems all in the name of “separation of church and state”. Honest discourse and dialogue should be encouraged.
Comment posted October 15, 2009 @ 11:18 pm
Something very unclear to me — for what reason would a public school book a band, regardless of flavor? And what on earth would a school pay them for?
This is simply a question for information. Should they be dispensing religious stuff, then there’s no doubt that they have no business being on campus with captive audiences.
Pingback posted October 22, 2009 @ 12:15 pm
[...] wrote a series of articles for the Minnesota Independent about the ministry and the fact that it may be running afoul of the Constitution by ministering at public high schools assemblies. The administrators at those schools say the group doesn’t mention that it is a ministry or [...]
Comment posted October 22, 2009 @ 12:25 pm
Groups like this peddle their hate, bigotry and beliefs, breaking the state and federal laws put in place to limit them. They are also committing fraud by taking money and knowingly using it for something other than its purpose.
This is just pathetic. Honestly, the reason why atheism is gaining so quickly, more than doubled in past 20 years, is because groups like this try to force kids, and others to their way of thinking. That is not sharing your faith, it is pure and simple brainwashing.
Comment posted November 12, 2009 @ 3:10 pm
You people are all ignorant. You have all been brainwashed with secular, revisionist history. Our nation was founded on the principles of Christianity, whether you want to believe it or not! There is no “separation of church and state” in the Constitution! However, there is a “separation of church and state” clause in the constitution of the Soviet Union! This is fact. In the early days of our Republic, all education in public schools was Christ-centered. I know, because I have many of the textbooks from that era. Some of these works include “A History of the United States of America”, written in 1823 by the Rev. Charles Goodrich. Noah Webster, who is the Father of American Education, wrote many Christ-centered textbooks, such as “Noah Webster’s Advice to the Young.” And then there was William McGuffey, who wrote the famous McGuffey Readers, all of which are Christian based. These are just the tip of the iceburg, there are many more. Furthermore, all fifty of the preambles to the state constitutions acknowledge God as the author of liberty, all of our currency says “In God We Trust” on it, our Liberty Bell is inscripted with a Bible verse, (Leviticus 25:10) the Ten Commandments hang on the wall of the US Supreme Court, the Capitol Building is full of Biblical artwork (such as the portrait of the baptism of Pocahontis)and both the Lincoln Memorial and the Washington Monument are laced with Biblical references. At one time, both the Capitol and the Treasury building were used for church services. And then there are numerous proclamations issued by presidents, governors, and Congress giving acknowledgment and thanks to Almighty God, as well as numerous rulings by both state courts and the US Supreme Court that we are a Christian Nation.
I know Bradlee and Jake, and all the people in YCRBYCH, and they are honest, decent, sincere Christian people. Before you run off your mouths and pass judgment on them, maybe you ought to meet them and get to know them a little bit. I am going to their dinner tonight, and I look forward to hearing Bradlee and Michele Bachmann speak. Before I part, I’ll ask you ignorant dummies one question; Where do your rights come from, God or man? If our rights come from God, which they do, then they are unalienable and no one can take them away. All His laws apply equally to everyone, whether rich or poor, black or white, male or female. This is true equality. If you do good, you should be rewarded, but if you do evil, you need to be punished no matter who you are. (Read Romans 13) If, on the other hand, as you folks evidently believe, that our rights come from man, then who makes the rules? Who defines what our rights are? You? Barack Obama? Nancy Pelosi? When government tries to decide what the people’s rights are, they are in essence playing God and trying to lord it over you. What government gives, they can also take away. As Thomas Jefferson said; “A government big enough to give the people what they want is also big enough to take away everything that they have.” Be careful where you tread, my friends. When you slander good people like Bradlee Dean and Michele Bachmann, you are playing with fire! If you were to get your wish and destroy the foundation of our country, the end result will be the destruction of freedom, and that includes your own. (Read 1 Samuel 8) You will only enslave yourselves.
Comment posted November 12, 2009 @ 3:18 pm
P.S. I would like to make one correction. Not all of you people are ignorant. Chris, I overlooked your comment, I should have looked more closely. You are correct in what you say. You mention Jefferson and the Danbury Baptists. You have a correct understanding of American History. Good work my friend.
Comment posted December 17, 2009 @ 1:44 am
it’s easy to see that while you can run rants about constitutional rights, they wish for our government to trample on the rights of those who are not like them… a list that includes Christians outside of their sect.
if my only option is to follow the teachings of you can run, then freedom will certainly have been destroyed.
Comment posted August 10, 2010 @ 10:41 am
I have read the Constitution, still can’t find separation of church and state in there, can any of you show me exactly what part of the Constitution it says it?
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