Emmer says he won’t back anti-bullying legislation

Emmer, the anti-equality candidate. Very small minded, small hearted of him.

In other words, Republicans like Emmer and Pawlenty want to be able to bully and pick on others, particularly kids. If that wasn’t clear before, it should be now. So much for their whole meme about “protecting the most vulnerable.”

I suppose your perspective on bullying is different if you’re the parent of a young man who is amused by drawing male genitalia on the faces of unconscious women.

“Every one of us has a point of view. We are supposed to respect each other’s point of view,”

What a totally odd thing for Emmer to say. The whole paragraph is odd and I heard him say this during the debate.

So I guess he’s saying we should listen to those guys who just tortured and sodomized that kid over the weekend with a wooden stick when they found out he was gay. After all, I guess they’re entitled to their opinion as to what should be done with gay kids.

Emmer seems confused. On the one hand he says, “I don’t think we need more laws.” And “We should all be able to have the point of view and respect each other but we don’t need more laws trying to get in between people.””

But yet he DOES support more laws, but only those which, unsurprisingly, want to enshrine his personal prejudices into law: “I believe marriage is the union between one man and one woman. As a legislator, I have consistently supported the constitutional marriage amendment that protects traditional marriage.” (http://www.emmerforgovernor.com/issues/socialvalues/)

So, clearly it’s not “more laws” or fewer laws at issue.

Emmer’s real rationale for opposing not only anti-bullying legislation, gay marriage, and even the rights of gay and lesbian couples to make decisions about the remains of their deceased partners, has to do with that which he rightly believes he can’t proclaim too loudly in public for fear of being seen–alas, it’s too late–as a bit of a nutjob: His personal god hates homosexuality.

Emmer is just dense enough to hold the remarkable belief that the alleged creator of the universe is in complete political agreement with one of its sentient bipeds located in one galaxy out of billions, in one of its solar systems, on a specific planet, at a specific geographical location, at a point in time in the species’ history of civilization–the “beer, bombs, and gods” stage of its cultural evolution, to paraphrase one writer. In other words, “An undead creature from ancient times–Jesus–hates it when two people put the wrong genitals in too close proximity to each other.”

In a rational, thinking and educated culture, this kind of rubbing-overripe-bananas-into-my-face crazy would be confined to rural dive bars (where customers frequently rub overripe bananas into their faces–it’s just how they roll), where the Emmers of the world would sit around getting sloshed, driving drunk, and shooting rifles at endangered species. Not that Emmer has ever driven drunk: http://blogs.citypages.com/blotter/2010/09/tom_emmer_campa.php

Emmer’s right. At some point you have to evolve from being a ward of the state and learn to stand up for yourself. If you don’t you’ll be looking for the great white father in washington to take care of you for the rest of your life.

Oh wait … I forgot that’s what most of you want.

This is the liberals’ Terri Schiavo. This kid chose freely to kill himself. There is no way to get around it. How many people who are truly proud of who they are kill themselves? Liberals like to link sexuality to race, but how many minorities are killing themselves because of the color of their skin? And with the unprecedented push by the Hollywood elite to make being game “the in, cool, hip thing” this continues. The kid knew he was wrong & he could not handle it. Plain & Simple. Finally, the media should leave the kid’s parents’ to grieve, not use it to push their far left agenda.

[...] Emmer, the Target- and Best Buy-backed Republican candidate for Minnesota governor, explaining at a weekend debate why he will not support anti-bullying measures in schools, despite the recent [...]

Emmer, how has that worked so far? haven’t you noticed? There is no respect and compassion anymore. Preach it it all you want, but in the meantime, more kids will be subjected to ridicule and stricter laws need to be put into place to protect students from those who will never care to have compassion.

Emmer wants to be our governor yet he is not willing to do the job. Part of being a governor is protecting the people and sometimes we need to make laws to do that. If it were Christian children being bullied, sodomized and committing suicide Pawlenty would have already passed the bill and Emmer would be making it stronger.

Dennis…. Huh? Where did that remark come from? We’re talking about Emmer’s ant-bullying comments here. Spur your horse, catch up to the posse pardner.

John wrote:

“How many people who are truly proud of who they are kill themselves?”

Are you talking about the many Iraq and Afghanistan veterans who are killing themselves?

ChapterandVerse -

If you visit this site regularly you will find a group of trolls – most notably Dennis and a guy named Jimmy/Rudy/Raymond(he got that name by playing fast and loose with this site’s rules and regs) – their response to pretty much every article boils down to “Government BAD, Taxes BAD and Liberals want to have sex with convicts and kill babies”
They are mostly irrelevant and mostly have nothing to do with reality. They can sometimes be entertaining and they are all interchangeable.

John knows how so wrong he is about why many children who are (or are perceived to be) LGBT or questioning are committing suicide, but won’t admit to this because that would mean he would have to let go of his prideful bigotry and freely kill himself because he is so wrong. Sheesh!

Most suicides are due to overwhelming pressures resulting in the total loss of hope that things will get better, and reflects very poorly on society – NOT the victims.

The Trevor Project – http://www.thetrevorproject.org
It Gets Better Project – http://www.itgetsbetterproject.com/

What: A Candlelight Vigil! We will stand together to demonstrate we are allies for those who have been bullied and vow to create safe schools for all.
When: Thursday, October 14. 7:00pm – 9:00pm
Where: Loring Park, Minneapolis
Who: Over 450 LGBT activists and allies!
Why: Because every student deserves a hate-free school!

[...] —Tom Emmer, the Target- and Best Buy-backed Republican candidate for Minnesota governor, explaining at a weekend debate why he will not support anti-bullying measures in schools, despite the recent [...]

Everyone is REALLY missing the boat on this one.

Bullying is bullying, period. If there is to be a law, it has to be applicable to everyone. To make a law that is only applicable to gay bullying gives a specified group of individuals more protection than others. Why should the punishment be different if the person being bullied is: gay, Christian, Jewish, Muslim, black, white, male, female…

Our laws can’t protect a specified group, but rather must protect everyone. And please don’t respond that this is a hate crime. Bullying itself is a hate crime regardless of who the recipient is.

Chris the voter guy, perhaps you missed the article at
http://minnesotaindependent.com/35560/advocates-call-anti-bullying-veto-a-lost-opportunity

Pawlenty vetoed a bill in March 2009 that would ” have directed school districts to provide teachers, staff and administration with training on how to address bullying.” This bill included FOURTEEN additional student characteristics including sexual orientation and gender identity.

It was the inclusion of “sexual orientation and gender identity” that formed the basis of Minnesota Family Council’s opposition to this bill hence Pawlenty’s veto.

This is why we are focusing on the issue of children who are LGBT or are questioning.

Some crimes are committed with the effect of terrorizing the entire community that shares that characteristic – hence the enhanced penalties under hate crime law. It is one thing to be beaten up, but quite another thing to be specifically targeted to be beat up because the victim possesses that one characteristic.

Try not to “miss the boat” anymore, honey.

I am not aware of the anti-bullying bill establishing bullying as a crime to be prosecuted. The bill REQUIRES school districts to address bullying based on the listed characteristics. Once passed into law, I can see how parents of children who committed suicide or otherwise suffered harm due to bullying that the school district did not decisively and swiftly deal with can subject the school district and its taxpayers to civil penalties.

Discussion of hate crimes in this context is moot really.

Emmer’s right. We need to educate and change peoples hearts. Men can be animal like when they lack Christian charity.

John’s comment makes sense only when seen from the point of view that gay people are supposed to be suffering martyrs for straights’ amusement. An honest person would see how Christian, heterosexual culture tells gay kids that they are less than human, unnatural, incapable of love, et cetera… and notice that maybe, just MAYBE, their culture has something to do with gay kids committing suicide.

I met Tom Emmer at the MN State Fair. He was standing around his tiny little booth and I took my Dayton and Clark stickers off so he wouldn’t know my allegiance right away.

I’m 22 and he could tell I was young so he asked me what issue was concerning me as a young voter. I told “Mr. Emmer, something concerns me. (he furrowed his brow and I continued) You want to be governor of this whole state, and represent and fight for everybody in it, yes?” “Obviously”, he told me smiling. “Well then, why do you fight against gay marriage so strongly? Aren’t you promoting discrimination when you say we aren’t all equal?”. “Let me tell you something” he replied. “This election is about jobs and taxes. People are out out of work and they are getting taxed to death…” I said “Yeah but what about gay marriage?” and he tried the job answer again. “Mr. Emmer, you’re avoiding the question.” “No”, he said, “This election is not about social issues. I’m not running on them and I won’t discuss them. They aren’t important”. Though I am not gay, I looked him straight in the eye and said “Well they’re important to me Mr. Emmer. And when I’m being treated like I’m not worthy of the rights you get because I’m gay, that’s hateful, and I don’t think you deserve to make decisions that cut me out of society.” (ok so I fibbed a bit, but I wanted him on the spot). He took a step back and said “Jobs and taxes are why people vote. They are the most important issue, and they are the things that divide candidates the most, plus congress has to pass a law for gay marriage to legal”. I said “So if the state congress put that legislation on your desk to be signed, would you just veto it, or sign it”. He came back with his whole “That’s not he issue” bit then because a couple who looked like they wanted to beat me were waiting, he actually pushed be away by my shoulders and thanked me for talking about my concerns.

Masterful politician really. But he doesn’t get what a big issue this is. He’s free to be a homophobe. But he shouldn’t be using his personal, archaic beliefs to determine what’s best for everybody. Everybody should be treated equal. If gay marriage is illegal, that leaves gay people out. If it’s legal, everybody is treated equally. The opponents don’t have to like it, but they also don’t have to have one. It doesn’t affect their day-to-day life.

Emmer’s right. We need to educate and change peoples hearts. Men can be animal like when they lack Christian charity.

——————————————————————————–

men can be oblivious and blind TO THE REST OF THE WORLD when they have TOO much christian charity.

Emmer is clearly unwilling to protect ALL Minnesotans, instead promising to let his prejudices inform his actions without question or conscience…

Do we still have dog catchers?

Well, Saul 2 Paul, a lot of “Christians” are sorely lacking in “Christian charity” towards others who are different so you may want to start in your own backyard first …

On second thought, what passes for “Christian charity” among many of those “Christians” includes unrelenting homophobia and all the social ills that this causes. So never mind, Saul 2 Paul, since I am now of the mind that the world might be better off without that “Christian charity” altogether.

There are other vehicles for providing social services and such charitable acts that do not require organized religion.

Boy, I wonder how the Dalai Lama got to be such a nice guy without Christianity or Christian charity? Could it be Christianity isn’t a necessary ingredient in forming a person with good values who treats his fellow man or woman with respect and decency?

Christianity is a moral system….much more….but that is the basics. Other people can have their own moral code, and get along okay, sometimes, but I would see an eventual collapse imminent in thier good behavior, because we all have a tendency towards sin and only with the help of God can we attain perfection. Sorry, never heard of Dalia Lama.

You are right: Even among professed Christians there is a real need for genuine Christian Charity. Most Christians don’t invest enough time into learning about their faith or practising it.

If you don’t like Christian Charity, try just Charity, or love. Honest, non selfish, llove. The world needs more love of the brand that Mother Theresa dished out. I challenge anyone reading this to look at a picture of Mother Theresa and not see unselfish love.

Lane, are you talking about government, when you talk about “other vehicles?” How many people are motivated to give their money to that and trust it gets to a poor person? :)

In addition to the safety net that government provides as a result of agreement by the people through its representatives, there are many non-religious non-profit organizations that provide charity. These entities’ finances are for the most part transparent with audits and frequent scrutiny/outcries helping to keep them honest.

> How many people are motivated to give their money to that and trust it gets to a poor person?

Since you brought it up, Saul 2 Paul, I don’t need to remind you of how often religious leaders steal church funds for personal use. What about the Roman Catholic Church spending millions in sex molestation lawsuits and settlements? What about mega-churches and TV shows supporting extravagant lifestyles of their charismatic con-artists? So much for giving “money to that and trust it gets to a poor person”! Hmmm.

Lane-

Thank you for directing me to the article. It only backs up what I said in my previous post. The following excerpt is from the article you provided

“the bill “gives preferential treatment and status to homosexuals, bisexuals, cross dressers, transvestites and transsexuals – persons who have sex change operations – by singling out sexual orientation and gender identity or expression for special protection.”

My point was (and I will say it again), bullying is bullying. When legislators start writing in who it covers, they will ultimately leave someone out. Our litigious and entitlement society will look for loopholes and exploit them for their personal or social gain. If there is to be a law, define the act and define the punishment and let it be said that it covers all humans.

Chris the voter guy is guilty of misrepresentation. The referenced article states:

The Minnesota Family Council, in an email to supporters, said that the bill “gives preferential treatment and status to homosexuals, bisexuals, cross dressers, transvestites and transsexuals – persons who have sex change operations – by singling out sexual orientation and gender identity or expression for special protection. Homosexual activists will use it as ‘leverage’ to promote acceptance and normalization of homosexuality, homosexual marriage and unhealthy sexual behaviors.”

This is scare-mongering propaganda. Again, the bill REQUIRES school districts to address bullying based on the listed characteristics; it does not address “preferential treatment” which by the way is in the purvey of the Minnesota Human Rights Act.

An anti-bullying law that is generic the way Chris the voter guy is arguing for would not stand constitutional scrutiny as the wording would be too vague. In such a situation, I can see where the act of holding a person to account for his words or actions is construed by that person as bullying whereas a person who is deaf is mocked as dumb with no intervention by the school staff who is not aware of the communication challenges that hearing loss causes. There would be no consistent resolution of situations as they occur nor would effective recourse in courts be available to those who are truly wronged.

As for loopholes, we do identify them and amend laws as needed. This is also true when it comes to standards that courts use to evaluate the merits of each case as they are filed. Things change as we learn from experience.

> men can be oblivious and blind TO THE REST OF THE WORLD when they have TOO much christian charity.

How so true! (shuddering sigh)

It’s pretty hard for Emmer to back anti-bullying legislation when, like Michele Bachmann, he is a supporter of a Christian Group called You Can Run But You Can Not Hide. This “Christian Group” is lead by a guy named Bradley Dean. The group puts on “Rock Concerts” for teens that are full of Gay bashing, and other thinly veiled “Christian” morality messages. Emmer and Bachmann have links on this crazy mans website. Check it out for yourself. It is shocking. There are also many YouTube links.

The Minnesota Human Rights Act is more concerned with banning discrimination on the basis of any of the listed characteristics; it does not assign preferential treatment to any class of people.

As for affirmative action, that is totally outside this discussion thread.

Then expect to see super-sized photos of gay teen suicides carried by protesters in front of Target stores because they donate money to this sack of excrement Tom Emmer.

Sell your Target stock. It’s going down.

Tom Emmer, I’d rather see you blow your brains out that see another gay kid commit suicide.

Alright, Lane, explain to me how the Catholic Church doesn’t go thorugh audits, at the parish by parish level? There is no outcry about how the Catholic Church spends its money?!? Give me a break! They are held to a higher standard than the average, little known, charity out there.

Let me also point out that Catholic Charities has a lot better record than most other organizations when it comes to the amount of each dollar used for “administrative” porposes. Some of the other organizations are called charities but use up to 60% of donated funds for administrative porposes instead of helping the poor.

Well, I didn’t bring it up, but it doesnt matter. I don’t know of any recent news of a Catholic Cleric embezzling funds. There are too many checks and balences.

I do agree with you on the mega church thing. There are some con artists out there. I don’t defend all religions, but, I do think that there are some out there that do an excellent job improving the lives of people through spiritual and financial help. As for the sex scandels, the reason the Catholic Church has been bled over them is because people see a way of extorting money from a large enity. Not excusing the behavior. Every barrel has some bad apples. But that is not our discussion.

Catholic Charities are seperate from the Catholic Church, financially. The Catholic Church and its members just support them a lot. Doing more good than most, or all other private groups out there. Look up Sharing and Caring Hands in Minneapolis.

I’m no Emmer fan, but all the talk about wanting mommy government to step in to stop bullying is a joke. How about promoting a culture against cowardice? Teach kids to stand up for themselves if they are picked on. If they happen to crush some bully’s nose, everyone will learn a lesson. Give the kid defending himself an afternoon of detention instead of expulsion.

But no, we can’t possibly have a culture that promotes bravery, honor, and strength and conforms to young men’s natural impulses (gay or straight). Not while the hate crime supporters and spoiled baby boomers who believe “violence is never the answer, except when we elect Dems and Reps who start two wars on puny Muslims” are at the helm.

Hey Emmer…I HOPE with EVERY Fiber of my being that One of your kids is either Gay, or perceived to be GAY and BULLIED! BULLIED til they come Crying home to thier HATEFUL A-HOLE FATHER & Mother. …and FYI Emmer – seen the picture of your family – You have 7 kids, and 1 or 2 “might be” ………g-a-y …statisically its pretty certain. There are 8 in our family and I have a gay brother and sister. Will be nice for your kids to know -that thier father is a Bigot,and homophobe…….that should cause some self-doubt, self-loathing, or even possible more severe problems for you in the future…and YOU sir will have NO-one to blame – But yourself!

John
Comment posted October 11, 2010 @ 10:19 pm
This is the liberals’ Terri Schiavo. This kid chose freely to kill himself. There is no way to get around it. How many people who are truly proud of who they are kill themselves? Liberals like to link sexuality to race, but how many minorities are killing themselves because of the color of their skin? And with the unprecedented push by the Hollywood elite to make being game “the in, cool, hip thing” this continues. The kid knew he was wrong & he could not handle it. Plain & Simple. Finally, the media should leave the kid’s parents’ to grieve, not use it to push their far left agenda.

Hey John – If you were in front of me now- You wouldn’t say a God-dammed word…cause your chicklets would be down your god-dammed throat….you make me sick…..drop dead.

Here’s an article I found extremly interesting. Beneath is the comment of a poster from the site I copied the article from.

Catholic League on Gay Suicides: Libeling Religion in the Face of a Tragedy

NEW YORK, NY (Catholic League) – Catholic League president Bill Donohue takes on those who are blaming churches for five recent gay suicides:
“On his CNN show last night (Monday), Larry King opened a segment with Wanda Sykes, Kathy Griffin, Tim Gunn, Lance Bass and others on five recent suicides committed by young gay men. Throughout the hour, the guests blamed the suicides on religion, Christianity receiving the bulk of the blame.
No one was more explicit than Kathy Griffin. Saying, “we really want people to connect the dots,” she confidently asserted “that’s why I believe there’s a connection between Prop 8, ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell’, and now the string of teen suicides.” She added that “a lot of the so-called religious leaders play into it.”
These people need a reality check. First, in most of the suicides it is far from clear that anti-gay bullying was the cause. Though it appears that Seth Walsh hung himself after being bullied, the reason the police did not press criminal charges is because the boys never “expected an outcome such as this.”
According to several reports, the Rutgers student who jumped off a bridge was non-plussed after he learned that his gay tryst was surreptitiously taped by his roommate and shown online; not long before he killed himself, he even wrote on a gay chat site that his roommate was “a pretty decent” guy. Reportedly, Asher Brown’s family says their boy was “picked on because of his size, his religion [he was a Buddhist who recently converted to Christianity] and because he did not wear designer clothes and shoes.”
Raymond Chase’s brother told ABC News that his suicide “was not brought on by bullying.” In the case of Indiana’s Billy Lucas, both the coroner and the school district said there “is no evidence bullying led up to the suicide.”
All of these deaths are tragic, but it is factually wrong to say that all were the result of anti-gay bullying. Worse, it is libelous to suggest that because Christianity (and Judaism and Islam) is opposed to homosexuality that somehow it should be held responsible for whatever bullying did go on. Indeed, to suggest culpability is nothing more than a thinly veiled attempt to stifle religious speech.”

- – -

The Catholic League is the nation’s largest Catholic civil rights organization. Founded in 1973 by the late Father Virgil C. Blum, S.J., the Catholic League defends the right of Catholics – lay and clergy alike – to participate in American public life without defamation or discrimination. It is led by its’ President, William A. Donohue, Ph.D.

1. Emma
October 5th, 2010 10:28 pm
Teen suicide rates have increased 300% in the last 50 yrs. The highest jump being in young girls. The AMA reports the most effective defense against this is 1. a strong family 2. friends who accept you for who you are and listen and 3. a strong religious background. To single out gays is misrepresentative of the facts. It is an epidemic, but not only for gay youths. For all youths.

S2P, I take it you agree that the all-inclusive anti-bullying bill should pass and be signed into law? That is all I care about.

As far as the anti bullying law goes, I don’t know at this point.
First of, I doubt any law is really going to prevent the bullying. I mean, every kid gets bullied in public schools and even if you have a policeman in every hallway it will still happen in the lockerooms or somewhere else.

Second off, I think gay marriage activists will likely try use the bill to further their agenda. I’m guessing it will be a little too, “all-inclusive.” Perhaps preventing bullying will include exposing all kids to the gay lifestyle and telling them it is normal and just another choice, instead of an unfortunate disorder. Or maybe the bill will turn into the vehicle that attempts to put homosexual acts at the same level of holy matrimony.

So, we’ll see, what the bill is.

In other words, S2P is all for anti-bullying EXCEPT for those who are LGBT or questioning. Bah.

Lane, that is not true. I myself was questioning my attraction. Turns out I had homosexual imprintation. I got it because of the junk I was seeing on soaps and TV. Every teenager is unsure of themselves and looking for what they want to be. If they see the personification of what they want to be in the person next to them, be it abbs, good looks, or personality, imprintation can develop. I fear it grows more common in this sex saturated culture where homosexual activists are pushing a disorder as normal.

So you see, I have nothing but empathy for those experiancing bi-gender, same sex, or are questioning, their attraction. I’ve been there. It was horrible. But even experiancing it, I knew it was a disorder and woudn’t have tried to set homosexual acts at the same level of the holy married state my parents enjoy.

OY VEY, S2P. All I am going to say at this point is that you are not in a good place, that you will sooner or later need to get away from your family and the Catholic Church to discover and accept who you really are.

To quote wendy (getEQUAL) elsewhere:

These professional bodies unanimously state:1. Homosexuality is an normal, naturally occurring trait2. “Reparative therapy” or “conversion therapy” does not work and is harmful to those subjected to it.

AMERICAN PSYCHOLOGICAL ASSOCIATION

Sexual orientation and homosexualityhttp://www.apa.org/helpcenter/sexual-orientation.aspx

Homosexuality: Nature or NurtureRyan D. Johnson April 30, 2003http://allpsych.com/journal/homosexuality.html

APA Officially Rejects Reorientation Treatment for Homosexuals — Overwhelming research from the past hundred years rejected due to “serious design flaws.”http://www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2009/aug/09080608.html

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

AMERICAN PSYCHIATRIC ASSOCIATION

POSITION STATEMENT Homosexuality and Civil RightsApproved by the Board of Trustees, December 1973Approved by the Assembly, 1973http://www.psych.org/Departments/EDU/Library/APAOfficialDocumentsandRelated/PositionStatements/197310.aspx

POSITION STATEMENT Therapies Focused on Attempts to Change Sexual Orientation (Reparative or Conversion Therapies)Approved by the Board of Trustees, March 2000Approved by the Assembly, May 2000

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

AMERICAN MEDICAL ASSOCIATION

AMA Policy Regarding Sexual Orientationhttp://www.ama-assn.org/ama/pub/about-ama/our-people/member-groups-sections/glbt-advisory-committee/ama-policy-regarding-sexual-orientation.shtml

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

AMERICAN ACADEMY OF PEDIATRICS

Policy Statement: Homosexuality and Adolescence (RE9332)http://web.archive.org/web/20031212181440/http://www.aap.org/policy/05072.html

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF SOCIAL WORKERS

Lesbian, Gay and Bisexual Issueshttp://www.socialworkers.org/resources/abstracts/abstracts/lesbian.asp

Position Statement: “Reparative” and “Conversion” Therapies for Lesbians and Gay Menhttp://www.socialworkers.org/diversity/lgb/reparative.asp?print=1

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

UNITED PROFESSIONAL ASSOCIATIONS REJECT “REPARATIVE THERAPY” also called “CONVERSION THERAPY”http://www.religioustolerance.org/hom_expr.htm

The American Academy of Pediatrics, American Counseling Association, American Association of School Administrators, American Federation of Teachers, American Psychological Association, American School Health Association, Interfaith Alliance Foundation, National Association of School Psychologists, National Association of Social Workers, and National Education Association formed the “Just the Facts Coalition.” They developed and endorsed “Just the Facts About Sexual Orientation & Youth: A Primer for Principals, Educators and School Personnel” in 1999.

The primer says, in part:

“The most important fact about ‘reparative therapy,’ also sometimes known as ‘conversion’ therapy, is that it is based on an understanding of homosexuality that has been rejected by all the major health and mental health professions. The American Academy of Pediatrics, the American Counseling Association, the American Psychiatric Association, the American Psychological Association, the National Association of School Psychologists, and the National Association of Social Workers, together representing more than 477,000 health and mental health professionals, have all taken the position that homosexuality is not a mental disorder and thus there is no need for a ‘cure.’

“…health and mental health professional organizations do not support efforts to change young people’s sexual orientation through ‘reparative therapy’ and have raised serious concerns about its potential to do harm.”

——————————————————————————–

Listen to the original founders of Exodus now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDiYeJ_bsQo

——————————————————————————–

FWIW, you can check out the University of Minnesota Program in Human Sexuality if you decide you need help.

http://www.fm.umn.edu/phs/

I feel so sorry for you S2P. I feel so sorry that you cannot fully embrace a part of you that was there since birth. I feel bad that you’ve been so brainwashed by people who just want to change a fundamental part of you.
I’m 22 years old and an out lesbian. I’ve been out for 7 years, and I can’t imagine coming out into a non-supportive family/community.
I really hope you come to realize the insanity of what you preach right now and come to fully embrace your sexual orientation and realize that it IS normal, and you can have a “normal” life, whatever that may be.

Family is normal. Relating to other people of the same gender is normal(without one wondering if you are hitting on them). Both are impossible if you are homosexual. That is why it is so hard for many. I feel so sorry for you Sara, I know it must be hard for you. There is nothing wrong of being proud of who you are. We all should be no matter what our attraction. Everyone deserves respect. But even if you feel that your attraction will never change, try to live a chaste life. We are all called to holyness and sancity. I will pray for you. I encourage you to check out COURAGE.

Right now, liberal activists propose that homosexual behavior is genetically inherited and therefore can’t be changed. However, there is nothing to support that theory, although there are well documented cases of people changing their attraction and living happily married lives.

The activists also like to propose that people are suppressing themselves/denying the real them, if they do change. I call that a lot of politically motivated bogus. After all, I’m in a position to know.

Having been through this hell, I would propose the Catholic Church is a ray of hope for many suffering from same sex attraction. That is why I would never leave it.

Proposing I give up my family makes me respect your advice little. My parents have been extremely supportive, in part because of our faith.

There are plenty of doctors out there who don’t agree that a person can’t re-determine their attraction. I don’t have time research it right now though.

Here is an article I believe is very revealing on this subject. I can personally agree with what is written here……

With abundant charity, the
Catechism of the Catholic Church acknowledges
that those who have homosexual tendencies
are many, and that this inclination
“constitutes for most of them a trial” (par
2358). Often people with SSA also struggle
with sexual addiction, drug or alcohol abuse,
depression, anxiety or other mental illness.
This remains true even in the places where
sexual promiscuity is widely tolerated. Men
and women with SSA—perhaps up to 40% of
them—may very likely have been the victims
of sexual abuse as a child. (This is good to
keep in mind if a young person claims to be
“gay”.) In many cases, they will say that as far
back as they can remember, they have “always
felt different”, or that they “did not choose
this”. But St. Paul offers a way forward: “We
know that in everything God works for good
with those who love Him” (Rom 8:28). In
everything . . . in every thorn.
By Rev. Paul N. Check
Sex & Culture
Courage and the Cross:
The Problem of
Same Sex Attraction
16 November/December 2008 StAR
Let’s continue with some history, a definition
of terms, and the origins of SSA
before turning to the question of morality.
North Carolina State English Professor R.
V. Young points out that not until the late
nineteenth century is the word “homosexuality”
accepted as a term of language
intended to describe the permanent condition
of a fixed group of people, namely,
“homosexuals”. In the language of the
Greeks and Romans and in that of Sacred
Scripture, the vocabulary used was drawn
instead from the action or the behavior.
Young suggests that this novelty allows the
proponents of the sexual revolution to control
the terms of social discourse. While it is
certainly true that we are transformed by
our actions, we can also agree that someone’s
identity cannot be collapsed into his
or her sexual appetite.
The word “homosexual” when used as a
noun is ambiguous and so not helpful in
discussion. Does it refer to an involuntary
attraction, to a chosen behavior, or to a set
of convictions? Furthermore, the psychological
sciences indicate that there is a wide
spectrum of those who are attracted to
members of the same sex, in terms of the
intensity of the sexual attraction. The
Courage apostolate then, prompted by
Christian charity and sound anthropology,
uses the terminology “men and women
with same sex attraction”.
Where does same sex attraction come
from? First, no scientific evidence establishes
the existence of a “gay gene”. If there
were a genetic explanation, then in those
cases where one identical twin has same sex
attraction, so would the other. As it happens,
the simultaneous occurrence of SSA
in such twins (who have identical genes) is
very low, perhaps as low as 10%. Beyond
that, the many well-documented cases of
change in sexual attraction would also tend
to disprove a genetic (and therefore fixed)
cause of SSA. Finally, as author and
researcher Dale O’Leary has remarked,
same sex activity is always sterile, and so it
cannot be considered a neutral variance
within the human population.
The Catechism of the Catholic Church
properly states that SSA is “objectively disordered”
(par 2358). These words can at
once be jarring and liberating. They are jarring
because they can be heard as a moral
judgment of the person (which they are not),
as opposed to an assessment of the inclination
as measured against human nature. The
desire to lie is objectively disordered, as are
desires to steal, to cheat, and to fornicate.
When acted upon, these inclinations will
always be contrary to the good of the person
as recognizable by the prima gratia, the natural
moral law, which is imprinted in the
mind and heart of everyone (cf. Rom 2:15).
The words from the Catechism are liberating
precisely for this reason. Something inside
the person with SSA tells him or her that
this desire does not accord with nature, and
the voice of the Church confirms his or her
instinct.
So we return to the question of the origin
or source of the problem. Same sex
attraction is a developmental disorder that
is both treatable and preventable. It indicates
an incomplete character development
likely based on the convergence of several
factors: temperament, environment, experience,
and free will. In other words, we are
born male or female, but we learn and grow
into our masculinity or femininity through
family and friends, acquaintances, and
other aspects of our personal and social history.
What matters in every case is how the
person responds to these factors.
Some circumstances do recur when the
profiles of many people with SSA are studied:
a broken or turbulent home, the child’s
alienation from the same sex parent (e.g.,
the boy from his father) or even the perception
of an estrangement, a child’s failure to
integrate with same sex peers (especially
true for boys), and sexual trauma. What this
means is that SSA is not first a sexual problem,
but a symptom or component of an
antecedent problem, i.e., a gender identity
deficit, and traceable in large part to how
someone reacts to the foregoing situations.
Something that should have happened in
the development of the child did not happen.
In particular, the natural desire for
healthy relationships with persons of the
same sex is frustrated or unfulfilled. When
this is coupled with other factors, particularly
a sensitive temperament, that desire
may become eroticized.
So feelings of SSA or “being different”,
no matter how far back they are perceived
to be, do not constitute proof that someone
was “born that way”.
An awareness of these things helps us to
identify children who could be “at risk” and
vulnerable to emotional hurt. Because the
incidence of men with same sex attraction
is probably at least twice that of women
with SSA, the relationship between fathers
and sons will always deserve special consideration.
Dr. Joseph Nicolosi from the
National Association for Research &
Therapy of Homosexuality speaks of the
absence of “shared delight” in the childhood
and adolescence of men with SSA,
the mutual and regular enjoyment of some
activity or experience between a boy and his
father that is otherwise part of normal
childhood. For example, many men with
SSA lack hand-eye coordination and as a
result were spurned or the subject of jokes
by their fathers or the neighborhood boys
because they could not play certain sports
easily. Quite simply, if a boy cannot throw a
football very well, there are many other
things that he and his dad can do and enjoy
together . . . but the initiative must be the
father’s.
At the same time, a mother who is overly
involved in the life of her son, especially
if she demeans the father in the eyes of the
boy or tries to make her son into a surrogate
husband, will likely do harm to the development
of the boy’s masculinity.
That the Catholic Church teaches that
homosexual activity (as distinguished from
the inclination) is gravely immoral is widely
known, but perhaps not widely understood.
Perhaps it can be explained this way. Moral
philosopher J. Budziszewski writes that as
individuals, we are “blessedly incomplete”,
which is another way of saying that we are
made for others. In the case of spousal or
conjugal love, the union of man and
woman in “one flesh” begins with the complementarity
of the sexes, namely, that man

is made for woman and woman for man.
This complementarity is physical, of course,
but it is also emotional, psychological, and
spiritual. Through their self-giving union of
minds, hearts, souls and bodies, the spouses
first transcend themselves, and then their
love becomes incarnate—or transcendent—
in a child. This is nature’s plan for marriage
and sexual love.
It is a short step from separating procreation
from marriage to separating sexual
activity from marriage, and then another
short step to separating sexual activity from
nature’s design. The widespread rejection
of the teaching of Humanae Vitae, which
simply expresses the natural order for sexual
love, explains the ambivalence of many
Catholics toward the Church’s teaching on
homosexual activity or same sex unions.
Neither our genes nor our environment
makes us do anything, and therein lies reason
for hope. A frequent temptation to
anger, for instance, does not mean that
someone must yield to or indulge that
prompting. St. Paul assures us that “where
sin increased, grace abounded all the more”
(Rom 5:20). Grace, perseverance, love and
the help of a therapist with a sound
Christian anthropology can transform the
hearts of those with SSA. When Jesus says
that the “truth will make you free” (Jn 8:31),
He is not so much imparting a theological
principle as reminding us what it means to
be human. We need humility to recognize
truth, and we need the virtue of courage to
live it. Freedom, strengthened and purified
by grace, makes it possible for any of us to
turn the wounds and thorns of life into the
path to joy.
Regrettably, many people think that all
that the Catholic Church offers to men and
women with same sex attraction is the word
“no”. Like all good mothers, the Church
does say “no” to the self-destructive and
counterfeit pleasure of sin, out of a sense of
love for her children. Yet that “no” is
embedded in a larger “yes”, a yes to Him
who is Love, and who gave Himself to the
Father and to us from the Cross. The Lord
asked St. Paul to find strength in his weakness
through the power of the Cross. The
Courage apostolate expresses that same
redemptive paradox to men and women
with same sex attraction and urges them to
trust in what they see in the life of the
Master and His apostle.
Rev. Paul N. Check is a priest of the Diocese of
Bridgeport, CT and the incoming Executive
Director of Courage, International. He earned
an STB from the Gregorian University and an
STL from the Athenaeum of the Holy Cross,
both in Rome. The Courage website is
http://www.couragerc.net.

BTW I think I may need to leave this thread as my personal life is pressing on my time. So if this is my last post….
God Bless you all!
Saul 2 Paul

Sara, isn’t S2P quite the comedian? His musty material is so old and stale …

His laughable suggestion that we lead chaste lives (what are we? Catholic priests?) if we can’t change our attraction makes me respect his advice little – but who cares? Oh yes, there’s that line about “homosexual imprintation” (what are we? ducklings and goslings?) …

But honestly, so sad – his whole routine.

Anyway, let’s carry on with our lives living openly, honestly, with courage and without shame!

And get this all-inclusive anti-bullying bill passed as of yesterday!

[...] anti-bullying legislation was proposed in Minnesota recently, Republican gubernatorial candidate Tom Emmer opposed it.  His [...]

I know one thing inthe ook of genesis the very beginning God created everything and he then created ma and he seen it was not good for man to be alone, so he put adam in a deep sleep and ook from him a rib and created woman.

So glad Emmer lost the race. He wasn’t for ALL Minnesotan’s!

[...] [...]