Did abortion politics derail budget talks, lead to shutdown?

I’m sensitive to the feelings and beliefs of people who believe abortion is against their values, but they’re not sensitive to my belief that social issues should be left out of this level of politics, especially in light of the budget crisis we’re in. I had a feeling something like this was behind the stalemate. It is beyond the pale that these ultra-conservatives would be trying to dictate the direction of Minnesota’s future. Any other governor would have caved by now, and without the courage of Gov. Dayton we’d be mere pawns of the rich.

About the time a person thinks they’ve seen and heard it all some crowd like this GOP crew takes the stage and proves out just how much lower and underhanded some human beings can get.

Just two words for the Sutton and Brodkorb puppets.

Unmitigated gall.

Jeff Wilfahrt, Rosemount, MN

Look Andy. Leader Koch said they were laser focused on the deficit during these talks. Laser focused. Don’t you believe her? The only other possibility is that Republicans don’t really understand what a laser is, or focus. With their contempt of science I suppose this is a distinct possibility.

This was a premeditated, organized and calculated lie to win elections. The R’s always intended to focus their laser beam on Gay Americans, women’s right to choice, stem cell research and re-drawing their legislative lines. And they have! At the expense of all Minnesotans. IT DOESN’T GET BETTER under their majorities and leadership.

http://www.alec.org/AM/Template.cfm?Section=Model_Legislation1

When you look at the leaked MN GOP memo that shows their conditions of what bills the Gov has to sign for them to come to the table,
you can see how much they are influenced or actually controlled by A.L.E.C.

We need to share the connection of bill templates on the Corporation controlled A.L.E.C. and the bills the MN Legislature want passed.

“This bill makes it perfectly clear that Minnesota Republicans choose to protect big business and insurance companies rather than defend the rights of Minnesotans,” said Sen. Latz.

Besides sharing this info with our Friends and family in MN we need to email talk radio, and local TV and newspapers. Post the info in comment sections of the online papers and websites.

We have expose to Corporate Ghost writers Al.E.C. again and again so people realize these shut downs and tactics are about selling off our government to private companies.

I was trying to search for MN Legislative members: from what is already on this thread and a little more here is what we have so far.
Please add if you know of other members or call your state Rep and Senators and ask if they are an A.L.E.C member and if so have the used an A.L.E.C template to write a MN bill.

Speaker of the House Kurt Zellers (R) although he qualifies himself by saying that he has “not been very active in ALEC.”

Sen. Mike Parry (R)
Sen. John Sterling Howe (R)
Sen. Chris Gerlach (R)
Rep. Paul Anderson (R)
Rep. Mike Benson (R)
Rep. Steve Drazkowski (R)
Rep. Sondra Erickson (R)
Rep. Mary Kiffmeyer (R) MN State Chair
Rep. Joyce Peppin (R)
Rep. LInda Runbeck (R)
Rep. Ron Shimanski (R)
Rep. Matt Dean (R)
Sen. Gen Olson (R) former MN State Chair

former
Representative Tom Emmer
Minnesota House District 19B (he used the A.L.E.C. privatizing prisons bill)

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to find out more and good links with info.
http://www.dailykos.com/comments/961112/40955029#c42

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and feel free to email our local news:

wcconewstips@wcco.cbs.com

fox9news@foxtv.com

ktcanews@tpt.org

Minneapolis Star Tribune
http://mpls.startribune.com/dynamic/feedback/form.php?o...

St Paul Newspaper Pioneer Press.
watchdog@pioneerpress.com

Ask them, why are they not reporting on the Corporate ghost writing of the MN GOP bills?

Here is the letter I sent:
There are at least 11 known members of MN Legislature that are members of A.L.E.C.

If you look at the leaked memo the Republican’s list of required bills that Gov Dayton sign, you will see the similar bills on the A.L.E.C website proving that it is Corporations and outside money and influence that these MN Republicans are representing and not the people of MN.

Members of A.L.E.C believe there is profit they can get from making Government services onto Private run services. Like prisons, schools, etc…

You can also Youtube A.L.E.C events and speeches.

Last year A.L.E.C member and Gov candidate Tom Emmer used A.L.E.C. written bill to push for privatizing prisons in MN.

Here is a list of MN A.L.E.C. members.

They are trained to stay on A.L.E.C talking points and why their speeches match those of other GOP Legislative members in other states.

MN A.L.E.C members.
Sen. Mike Parry (R)
Sen. John Sterling Howe (R)
Sen. Chris Gerlach (R)
Rep. Paul Anderson (R)
Rep. Mike Benson (R)
Rep. Steve Drazkowski (R)
Rep. Sondra Erickson (R)
Rep. Mary Kiffmeyer (R) 2011 Chair Person.
Rep. Joyce Peppin (R)
Rep. LInda Runbeck (R)
Rep. Ron Shimanski (R)

By ALEC’s own statements “45%” of ALEC members are ‘private sector’ members, and ‘public sector’ members, who pay minimal annual dues are only 1% of ALEC revenue ‘donations’ of their $7 Million budget, all paid for ‘donated’ by major US corporations, and the mega-rich like the Koch brothers.

“This bill makes it perfectly clear that Minnesota Republicans choose to protect big business and insurance companies rather than defend the rights of Minnesotans,” said Sen. Latz. (DFL)

Thought you guys might like to start reporting the whole story.

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If enough of us pressure the media and the MN GOP members then maybe we can get this shutdown over with soon.

Can someone please explain something to me? If the Republicans control both houses of the legislature, why can”t they just pass their own budget, and, send it on to the govenor. Then when he vetoes it, they can just blame him. I suspect that they do not have enough votes in their own caucus to pass their version of the budget. They want to force the govenor and some Democratic legislators to go along with them so they will have political cover for their screwed up plan. If the Republicans want to shut down the state, to protect a bunch of millionaires, let them do it alone.

Great job reporting, Andy! Was concerned that Maddow & Co. would have a difficult time getting to the facts!

Woodchuck, do you know how this works? The Republican put a balanced $34 billion budget on the Governors desk…he chose to veto it. I ask you to think about your own house budget for a moment. If your household income is $5000 a month, do you spend $6000? I would assume you do not. The revenue Minnesota will generate over the next biennium is $34 billion, the same amount on the approved budgets presented to the Governor. He wants to spend $35.6 billion, again more than we have. How can we do this since the State of Minnesota has a constitutional obligation to pass a balanced budget.

I recommend everyone take a look at the documents I posted. It gives the clear picture over what the republicans offered. It seems to dispute this ridiculous article from an “Independent Minnesota Source.” Independent…really?

The Governor also chose to sign the lights on bill which would have kept the government running, similar to what President Obama did a few months ago.

It appears this governor’s legacy is to shut things down. Do we remember when Senator Dayton shut his offices down for no reason. That left both parties wondering what he was doing. Oh yea, can I remind you that Senator Dayton was also rated as the worst Senator in the United States…a rating that will soon come with his governorship also. SO nice to have this guy as our leader.

umm, Woodchuck, that is what they did. They sent Dayton a budget and he vetoed it.

The funny thing about the truth….like Poe’s Telltale Heart, manages to find its way to the surface no matter what.

The R’s have orchestrated a deceitful gambit and are hoping no one notices.

But the information is already getting out. Its only a matter of time and the R’s will fall.

Truth and justice ultimately prevail. It’s just a matter of time.

I commend Gov. Mark Dayton for his defiance! Too bad t isn’t the Minnesota state legislature that won’t receive their pay.

Gov. Dayton should be a role model for our state and federal level democrats. They should learn to stand up to the republicans instead of caving… (remember the cave in with healthcare?)

And we as Americans should take a lesson from Vermont and vote Independent when our democratic politicians don’t represent us.

We need to demand our states require Independent Candidates be added to ballots.
Actually what we need is a multi party system.

Rhonda, Mark Dayton role model…really?

In your Webster dictionary is role model defined as: The worst rated, erratic Senator that did very little in the way of beneficial legislation for his constituents?

Or does role model equal a person who has continued to relapsing in and out of alcoholism?

Maybe role model (in your eyes) equals shutting down his senate office for a month, for no substantiated reason.

One last definition of role model: shutting down the state of Minnesota when you were offered a “lights-on” bill (similar to the Federal Government bill Obama showed leadership and signed).
Role model may not be the best choice of describing this guy.

Yes, role model. MD as the courage to do the job we, his constituents, sent him to do, including taxing MN’s wealthiest at the same rate as most of us working stiffs. Your smears betray the weakness of your argument.

Did abortion politics derail budget talks, lead to shutdown?=====Ummmmmm……Ya think?

Alec, they were focused on their own jobs, just like lasers. “How are we going to keep the rightwing base on our side after we make an irrevocable hash of the state budget?”

D-lite, I would like you to take a look at your family budget. If you have another kid, and the price of milk and everything else goes up, do you spend the exact same as you did last year?

With spending shifts and stimulus, we spent 34 billion last bi-ennium, and you are asking that we spend the exact same after having more kids and the price of everything going up?

Also, if you own a home, I would suppose that your entire debt is over 100% of your yearly income. Our government should not, I repeat, not run debt to GDP at over 100% like most families.

Comparing a governmental budget to a family budget betrays total ignorance.

The only worse thing is comparing a government budget to a business budget. Businesses want to grow and expand. They often take on massive financing in order to do so. Is that what conservatives want? Our government to act like a business?

D-Lite, you obviously have no idea how various family, state, and business finances work.

One last thing D-Lite. If the head of a household loses their jobs, one of the smartest things they can do is go back to school to make themselves more marketable. In these tough times, many, many families are taking on more debt now to try and win the future. Real families sometimes actually invest in their future D.

Alec,
Thanks for the debate. It is very interesting that you chose to take the same road that many of your democrat friends take when I debate with them….personal attacks. You have no idea who I am or what my background is, but you choose to attack me personally rather than debate the topic.

Have you ever used an analogy? Most people are so misinformed about how government budgets work, that you have to bring it to their level. You make valid points, of course the costs of goods and services go up, however, this is where your numbers are “ignorant” The 2010-2011 biennium budget was actually $29.8 billion (I challenge you to check it out). The federal stimulus brought our budget to $32.2 billion.

Can you tell me what the anticipated revenue for the 2012-2013 biennium? Correct! $34 billion. As you can see, yes, we are spending more than the last biennium and upholding the constitutional commitment to have a balanced budget.

Ignorance is really all about not knowing the topic Alec. The number are all available. I would challenge you to look at the spreadsheet (available on-line) comparing the spending for all departments within the State of Minnesota. You will be surprised to notice that spending $34 billion is over $4 billion increase (and the largest Minnesota budget in history) over the previous approved biennium spending.

Again true ignorance is not knowing the facts. Alec, I suggest you learn the topic before you attack someone personally. You have know idea who is sitting on the other end. Debate is good, personal attacks are also “ignorant”

D-Lite

????Personal attacks????? Are you kidding me? You came on this page with a defiant attack everyone here attitude and when someone calls you on your ignorance you pull the same ol’ GOP defense of “why you gotta call me names??”!! Alec was more gracious with you than what he needed to be. If your feelings get hurt that easily you really need to stay out of politics.

I am still waiting for someone from the GOP to explain to me why abortion and stem cell research bills belong in the budget.

I really love the radical left…always angry, feeling like they are “underprivileged” and have the “oh woe is me attitude.” Even better, many cannot hold a good, honest debate. I truly enjoy debating with intelligent, informed individuals. I feel it is healthy for our culture and it teaches us to dive into the source of the facts, rather than taking someone’s word. If you feel you have those qualities please come to the table prepared…because I will be.
Enjoy your July 4 celebration everyone…and remember one thing…we are all Americans :)

Yes, Dayton did veto a budget passed by both houses. As he said at the time, it wasn’t a balanced budget. Too many assumptions and made up figures; some of which were based on unprecedented things being done by other people, of which MN has no contorl. It was a sloppy, ideology-driven bill that fails to consider practical, pragmatic things like math.

@D-Lite
Go join your erudite intellectual equivalents who don’t use personal attacks with terms like “always angry, feeling like they are ‘underprivileged’” over at some highly intelligent site like Minnesota Family Council. You’re sure to get some real honest debate among your own ilk. You’ll be a happier individual that way.

Jeff Wilfahrt, Rosemount, MN

Oh, D-lite. Not really sure where you get your facts. Could you provide one simple link? Please?

Current Bi-ennium expected General Fund spending: 30.2 B
Stimulus bump for spending: 2.3 B
Education shift 1.9B
30.2+2.3+1.9 = 34.4B

34.4 > 34

Let me know where my math is off D-Lite. I’d be respectful in this debate, but it is obvious you and the truth are not close compatriots, so what’s the point. Provide a link D.

Here is a handy dandy chart. Super easy to understand.

http://minnesota.publicradio.org/documents/news/2011/04/GF-spending-changeA.PDF

http://minnesota.publicradio.org/collections/special/columns/polinaut/archive/2011/04/post.shtml

The problem with the budget is that it will gut the functioning of the state. The people who work for the state agencies know this. The MNGOP haven’t demonstrated much interest in talking to people who do the work.

This is a no-brainer: if 70,000 millionaires pay a fraction of what they paid before they went on corporate welfare in the 90s, the state can continue to serve the public good.

Study Hoover, Roosevelt, Keynes, and the failure of trickle-down ideology, D-Lite.
After you’ve studied some US history, then we can talk.

… and don’t forget that our property taxes are sure to rise, a point of fact glossed over in each GOP press conference.

Jeff Wilfahrt, Rosemount, MN

Well, all I have to say is that it sounds like D-Lite is a FoxBot of the first order. Talking point central, and pull out the Sarah defense when the ignorance is exposed. “Everybody is picking on me! Typical liberals! BooHooHoo!”

@JeffW Yes. Property tax point very impt! Thank you for bringing that to conversation. Actually, that kind of makes it clear that this isn’t about $$. It is about destroying organizations who oppose GOP.

D-Lite

The republicans spend their time screaming about smaller gov and then try to piggy back a dozen bills that will ultimately lead the the deepest and biggest personal control on citizens lives.

The Republicans can not stick to the issues at hand, they would rather have us without any service and loose millions of revenue a day than to actually do their Job.

The Minnesota IR just can’t resist taking one last opportunity, at the eleventh hour of what were supposed to be budget negotiations, to pander to their right-wing religious “base”. The holier-than-thou crowd demands it. And after all, they’re filling the collection plate at Repiglican headquarters.